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 [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)

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FireKiller87
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Sat Aug 06, 2011 4:15 pm

@Suguri wrote:
@FireKiller87 wrote:
Stun Regain regenerates 70% of damage taken by the user. Flat rate. This means that Stun Regain heals based on the final damage calculation, including guards, area where you were shot, etc.
How sure are you about this? Because there are instances where you can heal more than the damage taken.

I'd heard "70%" from somewhere. I have Stun Regain but never really conducted any tests on it, usually because when it kicks in, I'm busy fighting for my Seraph's life.

I've heard a whole shitload of theories, from 70% of damage regeneration, to regen based on TGH, or regen based on user's max HP or regen based on user's remaining HP, and everything in between.
I can't figure out what's true and what's not, but I still have to try.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Sat Aug 06, 2011 4:17 pm

Yeah, I'm not sure if anyone knows exactly how it works. JPwiki says 40~70% of the damage you received on the stunning hit, but that's very clearly not the case.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Sat Aug 06, 2011 4:22 pm

@Suguri wrote:
Yeah, I'm not sure if anyone knows exactly how it works. JPwiki says 40~70% of the damage you received on the stunning hit, but that's very clearly not the case.

Yay for HP gain by Winberrl AM spam.

If I had to guess, I'd say HP regeneration is probably based more on TGH and max HP than damage taken.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Sat Aug 06, 2011 4:52 pm

@FireKiller87 wrote:
@Suguri wrote:
Yeah, I'm not sure if anyone knows exactly how it works. JPwiki says 40~70% of the damage you received on the stunning hit, but that's very clearly not the case.

Yay for HP gain by Winberrl AM spam.

If I had to guess, I'd say HP regeneration is probably based more on TGH and max HP than damage taken.

Stun regain is hard to test because you get hit and don't know how much you recover, you need to repeat ad infinitum and analyze video recordings. However I'm going to refute max HP theory because on the first stunning hit, no matter how large or small, the amount healed is less than the amount damaged, it is scaled on the stunning hit.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Sun Aug 07, 2011 12:29 am

anyone know wich tier of boostrun equivalent with 36WLK vanilla
Question
@FireKiller87 wrote:

Stealth System equipped basically means the user will NEVER show up on radar with that bot, even if you're locked on. The only way to nullify Stealth System is to equip Broad Radar.
so, one of loading screen which said "warning!!, stealth system instaled, enemy didn't show in radar, you or one of your comrade must locked to enemy" or something like that is lying =o
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Sun Aug 07, 2011 2:12 am

@Nymph~ wrote:
anyone know wich tier of boostrun equivalent with 36WLK vanilla
Question
@FireKiller87 wrote:

Stealth System equipped basically means the user will NEVER show up on radar with that bot, even if you're locked on. The only way to nullify Stealth System is to equip Broad Radar.
so, one of loading screen which said "warning!!, stealth system instaled, enemy didn't show in radar, you or one of your comrade must locked to enemy" or something like that is lying =o

36 WLK is likely = to...i dunno, it's probably a mid-tier Boost Run. Boost Run will always be faster than normal running of the same speed.

You misread the loading screen. The only ways to put enemies on radar is if you or a teammate locks on. If the bot in question has Stealth System installed, they will not appear on radar even if you or a teammate locks on. Broad Radar allows you to see ALL bots regardless of Stealth System on radar, but you still will not reveal any Stealth System-equipped bots if you lock on.

tl;dr Broad Radar allows you to see Stealth-installed bots on radar. Only you can see them though, and you can't reveal their position if you lock on. To reveal any other enemy positions on radar, you or a teammate needs to lock onto the target.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Sun Aug 07, 2011 4:28 am

@Nymph~ wrote:
anyone know wich tier of boostrun equivalent with 36WLK vanilla
Question
It's teal, I think. Or it could be dark blue/green. It's not very high.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Sun Aug 07, 2011 12:55 pm

Until some actual hard information comes, I'm leaving stun regain description as is.


I might have done 200+ damage to someone by a backshot, but it probably when where the target was so far away, the damage number didn't appear. So I'm not sure. The numbers I do see appear, from the front, generally are 100+ though. The problem is, even though my EVE is 40 TEC, she doesn't have a force up on her cannon (I forgot to add that when I retuned her earlier). With a lot of AIRs lagging, it was kind of difficult at the beginning learning how to lead the target..different pinged people need different leads. Some people lag so hard, you don't lead them at all. In fact, a shot that completely "misses" hits right on target. Quite frustrating. Worst off, sometimes you don't know if your hit dissipated before it hit your target or if your leading just totally missed. zz.



Stealth system is what it is. The game is not lying. Stealth is simply another "rule" laid on top of that. So is sniper sight.


Vanilla WLK is VERY slow compared to boost run WLK. Boost run at 31 WLK is faster than 36 WLK by any chance. Makes me sad, but it's true. Once you've played with mostly boost run bots, it's hard to go back.


I do have a theory about winberrl's AMs:

Draw guns themselves do very low damage, but proc stun more often.

So the other guns that are currently hitting the target proc stun regain.

Since most of the bullets are low damage, stun regain causes target to heal more.


There also might be a thing where stun regain does calculate damage taken per shot, but not TGH reduced damage.

Ie. Your gun does 8 damage. Reduced by TGH to 1. Stun regain procs but heals 70% of the 8 unreduced damage.

Therefore, you heal around 4-5 hp? Add more guns, more people, and no wonder you heal like a madman.



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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Sun Aug 07, 2011 1:46 pm

yeah I noticed, even yello tier can outrun seraph (tested racing with one on berze run) at least before I run out of bost bounce
so I must get at least red tier boostrun on small melee
don't fell like to junk my ivis AGAIN, retune her is pain in the ........... scratch
@FireKiller87 wrote:
You misread the loading screen. The only ways to put enemies on radar is if you or a teammate locks on. If the bot in question has Stealth System installed, they will not appear on radar even if you or a teammate locks on. Broad Radar allows you to see ALL bots regardless of Stealth System on radar, but you still will not reveal any Stealth System-equipped bots if you lock on.
oh I see, we still not shown in radar as long as we don't get locked
stealth cart make u invisble in radar but broad radar nulify it lol!

and maybe it's bad idea to shoot high tgh + stun regain enemies with gatlings
if only CS gave berzellius stun regain lol!

anyway, thx for the explanation cheers


-----
another question..
where do I got midoro
6 days, questing all stars, all plannets only got ONE
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Sun Aug 07, 2011 3:40 pm

@Nymph~ wrote:
yeah I noticed, even yello tier can outrun seraph (tested racing with one on berze run) at least before I run out of bost bounce
so I must get at least red tier boostrun on small melee
don't fell like to junk my ivis AGAIN, retune her is pain in the ........... scratch
@FireKiller87 wrote:
You misread the loading screen. The only ways to put enemies on radar is if you or a teammate locks on. If the bot in question has Stealth System installed, they will not appear on radar even if you or a teammate locks on. Broad Radar allows you to see ALL bots regardless of Stealth System on radar, but you still will not reveal any Stealth System-equipped bots if you lock on.
oh I see, we still not shown in radar as long as we don't get locked
stealth cart make u invisble in radar but broad radar nulify it lol!

and maybe it's bad idea to shoot high tgh + stun regain enemies with gatlings
if only CS gave berzellius stun regain lol!

anyway, thx for the explanation cheers


-----
another question..
where do I got midoro
6 days, questing all stars, all plannets only got ONE

What
Impossible, unless the Seraph in question is uselessly slow as all holy fuck and is not using Wings. Only something like Red/Purple tier Boost Run can keep up with or outspeed Wings iirc. I tested with a clanmate who has an Ouka...I don't exactly recall her exact Boost Run stats but I'm fairly sure it was up there.

To clarify completely, Stealth cloaks you from all radar, including lock-on, except to players with Broad Radar. ONLY those players with Broad Radar can see you on radar and they can't put you on radar for anybody else. As far as radar goes, you're invisible to all but BR users.

Midoro Cosmos...I dunno, just do a lot of Bastagant and you'll find some.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:10 pm

judging from my rennys amazing tough and health values, stunregain itself is based on neither since i lived through 500+ damage in a teamfight while renny has not that much to begin with (416 hp 11 tough) the rest of the health came from stunregain and i had alot left ( about 80 if i remember correctly )

read: i didnt get hit often but hard, so stunregain resored a good percentage of the damage dealt

the other point is: did no one consider yet that stunregain might simply have a minimum value of health to regenrate ?

ps: by now i consider stun regain a musthave cartridge on any bot that offers it (there would be need of something like broad radar, stunregain and stealthsystem as lvl 9 cartridges to consider not to chose stunregain for me)
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Sun Aug 07, 2011 8:50 pm

@Aurum_Sol wrote:
judging from my rennys amazing tough and health values, stunregain itself is based on neither since i lived through 500+ damage in a teamfight while renny has not that much to begin with (416 hp 11 tough) the rest of the health came from stunregain and i had alot left ( about 80 if i remember correctly )

read: i didnt get hit often but hard, so stunregain resored a good percentage of the damage dealt

the other point is: did no one consider yet that stunregain might simply have a minimum value of health to regenrate ?

ps: by now i consider stun regain a musthave cartridge on any bot that offers it (there would be need of something like broad radar, stunregain and stealthsystem as lvl 9 cartridges to consider not to chose stunregain for me)

A lot of bots that offer Stun Regain offer it as a Lv6 cart. -cough cough-SERAPH-cough cough-
You'd have to reject Stealth System as a cartridge on almost all bots. Stealth System is very situational and is nullified by one of two things:
1) Broad Radar(only the user can see you though)
2) Being spotted physically, which is almost immediately after or before you commence an attack -_-
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Mon Aug 08, 2011 3:32 am

I use my green tier cosmo kaisher and i can keep a pace with seraph on long path in Boss berze, wings ON, ofcourse b I'm out of boost =o
ps : i have stun regain on my seraph bounce



[quote="FireKiller87"]
@Aurum_Sol wrote:

You'd have to reject Stealth System as a cartridge on almost all bots. Stealth System is very situational and is nullified by one of two things:
1) Broad Radar(only the user can see you though)
2) Being spotted physically, which is almost immediately after or before you commence an attack -_-

@FireKiller87 wrote:


To clarify completely, Stealth cloaks you from all radar, including lock-on, except to players with Broad Radar. ONLY those players with Broad Radar can see you on radar and they can't put you on radar for anybody else. As far as radar goes, you're invisible to all but BR users.
ok, which one is right here scratch
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Mon Aug 08, 2011 5:10 am

Uh, they're both right. You don't show up on radar to anyone that isn't using broad radar, but you can still be physically seen.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Mon Aug 08, 2011 8:47 am

[quote="Nymph~"]I use my green tier cosmo kaisher and i can keep a pace with seraph on long path in Boss berze, wings ON, ofcourse b I'm out of boost =o
ps : i have stun regain on my seraph bounce



@FireKiller87 wrote:
@Aurum_Sol wrote:

You'd have to reject Stealth System as a cartridge on almost all bots. Stealth System is very situational and is nullified by one of two things:
1) Broad Radar(only the user can see you though)
2) Being spotted physically, which is almost immediately after or before you commence an attack -_-

@FireKiller87 wrote:


To clarify completely, Stealth cloaks you from all radar, including lock-on, except to players with Broad Radar. ONLY those players with Broad Radar can see you on radar and they can't put you on radar for anybody else. As far as radar goes, you're invisible to all but BR users.
ok, which one is right here scratch

Fail quote bro :3

Also, keeping pace with a Seraph is...yeah, I dunno about green tier. With wings out you're looking at 40+ FLY...anybody do any testing on this?
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Mon Aug 08, 2011 10:12 am

@FireKiller87 wrote:

Fail quote bro :3

Also, keeping pace with a Seraph is...yeah, I dunno about green tier. With wings out you're looking at 40+ FLY...anybody do any testing on this?
yours is a phail to xD
afaik,
LND wlk always faster than fly if it both of them equivalent
cuz LND got +10 bonus, is it right?
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Mon Aug 08, 2011 10:20 am

@Nymph~ wrote:
@FireKiller87 wrote:

Fail quote bro :3

Also, keeping pace with a Seraph is...yeah, I dunno about green tier. With wings out you're looking at 40+ FLY...anybody do any testing on this?
yours is a phail to xD
afaik,
LND wlk always faster than fly if it both of them equivalent
cuz LND got +10 bonus, is it right?
Wrong, because flight speed is faster, and airs also get a speed boost from angular velocity on top of that.

You need very high level boost run to match pace with airs (red to keep up with 38 fly, violet to keep up with seraphs), which takes you a lot more tuning (and even a cart) than it takes them.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Wed Aug 10, 2011 2:30 am

Also note that Lands only have...7 seconds of Boost Run, iirc.

Compare that to an Air, with 10 seconds of aerial action, or a Seraph, which can have up to 33 seconds of straight flight with no breaks.

Figure all that in, and you generally get that Boost Run vs. Air flight is kinda inefficient. I would rather fight Air-to-Air(with an Air of equal or near-equal speed) or from long range rather than try to close with an Air of that tier speed.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Wed Aug 10, 2011 2:37 am

@FireKiller87 wrote:
Also note that Lands only have...7 seconds of Boost Run, iirc.
7.5 seconds, but I guess that's just splitting hairs.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Wed Aug 10, 2011 2:46 am

@Suguri wrote:
@FireKiller87 wrote:
Also note that Lands only have...7 seconds of Boost Run, iirc.
7.5 seconds, but I guess that's just splitting hairs.

What about Artillery? They have a four second flight gauge, but I don't have a Boost Run ART to test on.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Wed Aug 10, 2011 3:03 am

@FireKiller87 wrote:
@Suguri wrote:
@FireKiller87 wrote:
Also note that Lands only have...7 seconds of Boost Run, iirc.
7.5 seconds, but I guess that's just splitting hairs.

What about Artillery? They have a four second flight gauge, but I don't have a Boost Run ART to test on.
10 seconds.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Fri Aug 12, 2011 3:48 pm

Note:

When using Fire Pillar or Hurricane Blow in midair, the vacuum wave/pillar of fire will descend in a diagonal line from your location until it strikes the ground, and then it will continue it's path from there. The angle and speed of descent is constant. Any bot caught by the item while it is descending will still suffer all effects of said items.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Fri Aug 12, 2011 6:14 pm

correct me if I wrong
CV give some resistant to burning effect, tested when with my friends using burner, he can't gimme burn debuff at all, is it glitched?
also CV user can't be draw with draw gun but why when I saw some video bot with CV tune, it seems winberll still able to draw them
scratch
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Fri Aug 12, 2011 7:20 pm

@Nymph~ wrote:
correct me if I wrong
CV give some resistant to burning effect, tested when with my friends using burner, he can't gimme burn debuff at all, is it glitched?
also CV user can't be draw with draw gun but why when I saw some video bot with CV tune, it seems winberll still able to draw them
scratch

So far as I know, CV only inflicts resistance to stun. You can still be drawn, burnt, shocked, or given any other status effect.
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PostSubject: Re: [General] Cosmic Break: an Extensive Compilation/Guide (Updated 6/30/13)   Sat Aug 13, 2011 11:31 pm

@FireKiller87 wrote:
@Nymph~ wrote:
correct me if I wrong
CV give some resistant to burning effect, tested when with my friends using burner, he can't gimme burn debuff at all, is it glitched?
also CV user can't be draw with draw gun but why when I saw some video bot with CV tune, it seems winberll still able to draw them
scratch

So far as I know, CV only inflicts resistance to stun. You can still be drawn, burnt, shocked, or given any other status effect.

^This. CVeil =/= INVINCIBLE TO ALL. It just means you can't be broken out of your combo except through status effects.

FYI, it also means Ivis can be bound while CVeiled. Trust me, I know that for sure.





In other news, will add that later Fire, as well as the multitude of weapon tip info thingys that I've scanned but missed to add (mostly from firefly, intet and a few others). Final version should be coming up soon, and from there on, it'll just to add weapons/bots..and linking other guides here.



Sad to say, this may be my last large project. Might have some brief robo bios posted in the guides sect for the bots I play most of, but my attention in this game wanes quite a bit these days..
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