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 CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos

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Raniko
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PostSubject: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sat Apr 08, 2017 7:47 pm

I know someone did the tiering of the bots here but this tier list is more like a guide and reference point on comparing your bots against an encounter of another bot. Will explain further down how to do so.

If you're wondering how this works, don't worry it's easy, you just have to fill in this questions in your personal opinion of a certain bot you own and played, I'll collect these and do some calculations for the ranking score:
Quote :

-Bot Type: (lnd, art, air, supp)
-Limited rule: (yes, no)
-hard-play rating: (0-10)
-easy-play rating: (0-10)
-Special system, Built-in core tune, Unique WB, Locked WB: (yes, no)
-Moe or mech: (moe, mech)
-Age: (date of release, or estimated age from release)
-Customability rating: (1-10)
-Arsenal count: (number of main and sub weapons)
-Self buff: (list self buffs on the bot)
-Supp buff: (list buffs for the allies, i.e. heals, ammo suppy, CV field, etc.)
-Primary Debuff: (list debuffs that can be used consecutively, i.e. Stella and Hyger's charge delay rifle)
-Secondary Debuff:  (list debuffs that can't be used consecutively, i.e. moray cannon, lisel cannon, Philia and Kagura's melt traps)
-Single-shooter power: (insert FORCE of the weapon and the number of shots it makes in one salvo)
-Alphastriker arsenal power:  (number of main weps on the alpha build, only applies to alpha builds)
-Primary Melee force: (insert melee FORCE of the melee wep you primarily use)
-Primary Melee range: (insert melee RANGE of the melee wep you primarily use)
-HP healed x Ammo: (*applicable to healers; insert HP HEALED value and the AMMO of the heal wep)
-Type consumption [nonweakness + weakness]:
(Your estimated rating on killing specific bot types)

  • Supp: (0-10)
  • Air: (0-10)
  • Land: (0-10)
  • Art: (0-10)

-6500 points break from training room 03 in Legion rooms: (yes, maybe, no)
-Legion room score: (insert your score from a match/matches in LEGION ARENA)
-MainWep set: (please refer to projectile visual guide)
-SubWep set: (please refer to sub wep visual guide)
-part capacity count: (list the parts that can be removed or replaced)
-Tune up completion: (your tune up rating if the bot is tuned)


Old instruction:
 

Projectile visual guide: wrote:

     
Cannon:                         Linear:                    Missile:                        Linear Angular:            Missile Angular:            



Remote:

 

Barrier:                         Heal:

*Vainic, Balth barrier,
melee shield is still
considered in this case



subwep Visual guide: wrote:


Outdated:  Cleave:       Stab:        Rapid:            Counter:      Heavy(or Slam, DropKick, Pound, D*ccslap, etc):  
____


Step:                                  Self-defense(or traps, parry, decoy dash, anti-homing, etc):





 


*Reminder that special builds are included but no need to state the specific parts of the build.
*Put the assessment in the comment section here, I’ll look into it.
*You can send me a txt file for your assessment if you want it to be relayed privately.

If this still confuses you, here's a sample from one of the participants who provided his personal assessment on a bot:

Jocena wrote:
Berzelius Girl

-Type: Art
-Limited rule: No idea
-Manual-play points: 7
-Auto-play points: 3
-Special system: Built in Air Loop, Free non great success Guard Dash, Free unique 1* useful core tune That's Mine!
-Moe or mech: Moe
-Age: 17/4/2014, almost 3 years old
-Customability rating: 6
-Arsenal count: 6
-Self buff: Can do full reboosts with propellant buff, but changes her from Art to Air type
-Supp buff: No
-Debuff: Dash Restrict (variant's weapon)
-Single-shooter power: (not applicable)
-Alphastriker arsenal power: 5
-Type consumption [nonweakness + weakness]: *Should assume that her weakness is Art*
Sup=8
Air=7
Land=4
Art=3
-6500 points break: Should be?
MainWep set: Missile, linear, linear angular, linear, linear
SubWep set: Blast Tackle (step?), Reboost
part capacity count: 1 BSJ, 1 BS, 2 Handhelds, 2 Greed Weapons and 2 pairs of unique weapon to fit
Tune up completion: 100%

If you're still doubtful about this, here's the sample chart of the tierings:

Quote :
update on the tiering chart of the bots so far from the assessment I got. For clarification, this chart is more of a guide on how capable the bot is to fight against other bots. (lole)

Gray'd names are the old assessment records that didn't undergo to the updated calculations, so consider it as partially-false.

Yellow names are the stock/untuned versions of the bots based from personal assessments

Orange names(T) are tuned/customized versions of the bots based from personal assessments.

How to use this as a guide:
-Roman numerals is the amount of difficulty of a bot is used based from the personal assessments
-The letters that indicate Tiers would determine how capable the bot can kill each other on the same tier.
-X tier means "forbidden" or "broken" because of how easy it is to carry a team or frag things for the whole match





"So how do I use the chart to as a guide?"

Well this may take a while. Due to how situational and unexpected CB is, the plots in the chart doesn't signify a fixed tier. That would mean the plots in the chart is more like a reference, standing point or a foundation. If you want your bot to beat some higher tiers, you may either turn the difficulty into easy on using your bot OR customize it to increase its ranking score. How to do these? Well, to turn your bot's difficulty to easy will be like doubling your efforts and "skills" to get your bot to move upwards in the chart, hence increasing your tier and capability to beat other bots in that tier. Efficient customization would lead your bot to move right in the chart which also leads to a higher tier, however customization itself has its limits so you have to rely on your effort.

To prove this to be true, check the bots who have untuned records and tuned records in the chart, you notice most of them go further up the tier, but if a player with high "skills" were to assess it, they might be able to go on X tier.

That is all so far, I'm open for suggestions and criticism to adjust and update the algorithm and chart!


_______________________________________________#em3 Happy Icy #em3____________________________________________

.


Last edited by Raniko on Fri Apr 14, 2017 7:15 am; edited 2 times in total
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Kuzuha
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sat Apr 08, 2017 8:34 pm

Why isn't Aletta on the same tier as Alice?
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sat Apr 08, 2017 8:35 pm

JetKaru
Type: Hikaru Niggaru
Limit Rule: There is only one Hikaru
Play Point: 10/10 fag points
Special system: JET accel. laaaaaggg loooopp
Moe or Mech: both are invalid, It's Hikaru
Age: RIP Hikaru
Customizability: JetKaru is life, can you customize life? you tell me
Arsenal COunt: ∞
DOes it buff? debuff? selfbuff?: Hikaru is a buff nigga, which debuffs other niggas, which self buff his Kneegrow levels.
Weakness: Weakness?! what weakness?! It JetKaru

Points BreaK: ITS OVER 9000
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Raniko
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sat Apr 08, 2017 9:02 pm

@Kuzuha wrote:
Why isn't Aletta on the same tier as Alice?

both are on the same tier fyi, both are in X tier. The difference is that Aletta has higher difficulty than Alice

@WhiteTofuMagic wrote:
JetKaru
Type: Hikaru Niggaru
Limit Rule: There is only one Hikaru
Play Point: 10/10 fag points
Special system: JET accel. laaaaaggg loooopp
Moe or Mech: both are invalid, It's Hikaru
Age: RIP Hikaru
Customizability: JetKaru is life, can you customize life? you tell me
Arsenal COunt: ∞
DOes it buff? debuff? selfbuff?: Hikaru is a buff nigga, which debuffs other niggas, which self buff his Kneegrow levels.
Weakness: Weakness?! what weakness?! It JetKaru

Points BreaK: ITS OVER 9000


lmao, I'll try putting this in the chart for derps
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elmatalast
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 5:01 am

You shouldn't have posted this in this forum
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 5:54 am

@elmatalast wrote:
You shouldn't have posted this in this forum
Why tho? I never got what's so problematic about tier-lists (well aside of the fact that they are changing over the time), assuming people don't go all aspergers over it or turn savage because their favourite unit is considered bad, or broken, or whatever. At this point the userbase should be small and adult enough, to actually discuss tiers (okay, the current state of the game makes discussing tiers pointless, but that's a different story I suppose).
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:21 am

guys guys, don't worry, I'm not the kind of guy that sulks easily, I'm used to peeps toppling my ideas [parents, relatives, workmates hurr durr]. But yeah, I'm putting constant change as an aspect hence why I asked for age and personal experience and ratings.

But yeah, I'll work on nigkaru since I don;t have data received atm.
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:26 am

Interesting.

Rosette - 1st backlog:
 

Edit: Fix limited rule. thought if bot is legal for limited room, it's yes instead Neutral


Last edited by Fairlion on Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:50 am; edited 3 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:44 am

@Fairlion wrote:
Interesting.

thank you for the interest~

@WhiteTofuMagic wrote:
JetKaru
Type: Hikaru Niggaru
Limit Rule: There is only one Hikaru
Play Point: 10/10 fag points
Special system: JET accel. laaaaaggg loooopp
Moe or Mech: both are invalid, It's Hikaru
Age: RIP Hikaru
Customizability: JetKaru is life, can you customize life? you tell me
Arsenal COunt: ∞
DOes it buff? debuff? selfbuff?: Hikaru is a buff nigga, which debuffs other niggas, which self buff his Kneegrow levels.
Weakness: Weakness?! what weakness?! It JetKaru

Points BreaK: ITS OVER 9000

I'm done working on your assessment fam, here's the result:



if you want to know what I put, here's the input, some of your joke answeres resulted to null lole #em3.5 #em3.5



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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 6:57 am

Tier S: Accel Saber
Tier PU: Everything else

Oh wait woops wrong year, time travelling can be very disorientating sometimes.
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 10:47 am

@reVelske wrote:
Tier S: Accel Saber
Tier PU: Everything else

Oh wait woops wrong year, time travelling can be very disorientating sometimes.


it would be good if I can grasp some data from the old players. More diversity in the chart tbh
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 11:58 am

Its hard to grade some things with this, like bots that specifically interact with one other bot.
for example, if you do this assessment to a vehicle, such as lagpit, or spaceship, they would be very very bad. but when they are with a dedicated turret bot, they are rule breaking. ( for example, turret can fire stuff with still shooter buff while traveling at max speed or mobility carts) So the assessment would be a poor representation of what a bot can do.other stuff like, magnell+machinlet 2.

also, the point break thing should be how much you can score in legion, training 3 is just too short. on that note, do you have specific way to include melt/burn damage? are they integrated as part of the debuff or do you plan to put them as part of the points.

I think what you are trying to do is actually a lot simpler.
1.Name a bot or build you want to play
2.list as many bots/type of bots that are relevant and see play in arena ( eg, air melee, moray arts, homura, bikes, etc), this list should be constant and when updated, all the rating so far would change
3. for each of the mentioned above, describe how easily your bot handle a a scale of 1-10 and possibly explain why
4. find average
5. We don't talk about support bots
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 4:22 pm

should we mention counter picks?
like:
sasha vs pina
bapho vs beri, flare momiji, and odette
ivis vs support rejection
alice vs railgun?

idk i've been seeing some specific match ups
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 5:04 pm

What About Indo's how do we counter pick those.
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 5:05 pm

@Sakura1 wrote:
What About Indo's how do we counter pick those.

Play low latency rooms
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 7:54 pm

@Sakura1 wrote:
What About Indo's how do we counter pick those.
lock on sub weps
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 8:25 pm

@WhiteTofuMagic wrote:

Its hard to grade some things with this, like bots that specifically interact with one other bot.
for example, if you do this assessment to a vehicle, such as lagpit, or spaceship, they would be very very bad. but when they are with a dedicated turret bot, they are rule breaking. ( for example, turret can fire stuff with still shooter buff while traveling at max speed or mobility carts) So the assessment would be a poor representation of what a bot can do.other stuff like, magnell+machinlet 2.

also, the point break thing should be how much you can score in legion, training 3 is just too short. on that note, do you have specific way to include melt/burn damage? are they integrated as part of the debuff or do you plan to put them as part of the points.

I think what you are trying to do is actually a lot simpler.
1.Name a bot or build you want to play
2.list as many bots/type of bots that are relevant and see play in arena ( eg, air melee, moray arts, homura, bikes, etc), this list should be constant and when updated, all the rating so far would change
3. for each of the mentioned above, describe how easily your bot handle a a scale of 1-10 and possibly explain why
4. find average
5. We don't talk about support bots

To answer to the mchnelet2 and magnell, heck even alestar, issue is that they are considered as bots with special systems. I consider them as a bot with unique skill that is equal to the aura, transform, etc. bots. However it will also be linked on player's judgement if it's easy for them to use[auto] or hard[manual]. Hence it would be predicted that those mentioned bots will be placed on the lower rows

all debuffs are counted in the assessment and are integrated into the calculation, but as I said, it would be pretty much reliant on how the player's auto-manual judgement. i.e. if you're a good player on using just brute force cannons with no debuff effects, then we can safely assume that you'll be god when you use stella or hygers. [yes, god is not a typo]

hmmm, I'm kinda considering your opinion about the legion rooms being a source for a score break since it has a different level of difficulty. I've heard about others pointing that out too. [if you're worried that the chart will be trashed if the algorithm is changed, then don't, I have recorded every assessment I got recently so I can just copy paste everything on the algo]

Also about "no supports" thing, uhhh I added the heal, barrier, special system, etc etc to satisfy the supp's rankings. Same goes to melees, however in the melees case you need to enumerate how your melee combo goes, so far what I've listed is just based from my preferred melees, feel free to add those I don't know yet so I can adjust.

@CxM wrote:

should we mention counter picks?
like:
sasha vs pina
bapho vs beri, flare momiji, and odette
ivis vs support rejection
alice vs railgun?

idk i've been seeing some specific match ups

I said it on the last paragraph but prolly I didn't relay it well. As you can see I mentioned that the results in the chart is more like a basis point, if your bot is on that tier, you have the capability to beat up the bots on the same tier as you, however fighting against a bot on a higher tier would be difficult unless your skillful[raises your bot's difficulty to easy] and customized it to the most efficient degree [moves your bot to the right side of the chart].

But yeah, I don't have any assessment records of bots that you mentioned.

@Sakura1 wrote:
What About Indo's how do we counter pick those.

I mentioned that the results of the chart is a basis point, if we have the condition where the player is laggy, they might move the bots plotted in the chart to the upper right, countering them would require you to double your effort that will make your bot reach their levels.
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sun Apr 09, 2017 10:39 pm

- U P D A T E -

I just got an assessment sheet for the D Thoarla HM path and Rosette.



@Fairlion wrote:
Interesting.

Rosette - 1st backlog:
 

Edit: Fix limited rule. thought if bot is legal for limited room, it's yes instead Neutral

Sorry I didn't notice your edit Cloireb Sad Icy
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Fri Apr 14, 2017 7:57 am

- U P D A T E -

There's now a change on the assessment template, please check the original post.

-School Lily Rain BF(Tuned)[SLelRenBF] has been added in the chart
-Lily Rain HD, Crimrose HD, Rosette has values updated due to the template add-ons





Thank you also for Veriti, WhiteTofuMagic, Lunar-chan, elmatalast for some suggestions for the template
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PostSubject: Re: CosmicBreak fan-based tier assessment of Robos   Sat Apr 15, 2017 2:45 pm

@Raniko wrote:
comparing your bots against an encounter of another bot
I think only tuned bots should be assessed. an untuned bot is probably not relevant in the arena. it will get out maneuvered, out gunned, and out preformed. A build is "yours" after you tuned it, whether you copy pasta a build or made it yourself . unless of course you think there is definitive "normal" way to tune a bot, set that as the standard, and everything else "custom builds". That would be hard for a few bots since there is no normal way to tune them.

It is very important to include the cosmic calc data of what ever bot is submitted for assessment. This build need to exist in the first place, no matter how outlandish it may seem
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